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2009-06-15
以下是一家fund firm 的market comment,由于各种原因,在下不能将全文奉上。
One school of thought is that, in the longer-term, the debt service resulting from the current fiscal stimulus can be managed only by monetisation, resulting in unexpectedly high levels of inflation and a weak bond market .Besides, the dollar would be abandoned as the reserve currency of choice. Another is that there is no viable alternative to the current Keynesian stimulus plans, as evidenced by ample historical precedent from the New Deal and the Great Depression. Policy makers will eventually reverse course and tighten policy, but not yet - the recent moves in treasury yields are indicative of a return to more benign economic conditions after the deflation scare of late 2008.

But why might all of the ivory tower debate matter for commodity investors?(注:文章前面曾提到凯恩斯主义学者与货币主义学者之间的辩论。)In a variation on the "heads-I-win-and-tails-you-lose" scenario, the conclusions from many seem to be that commodities would do well under either scenario. In the inflationary world, where money supply is increased to service debt then demand should rise for real assets, especially if the dollar loses more of its value. In a New Deal (new version ) world, then the global economy will eventually tend towards normalisation and will be a return to the themes of globalisation and the secular rise of China and other emerging markets.

A pause is warranted here. A groundswell of opinion that says markets will go up come what may, should be cause for concern. At this point, we have no highly held conviction about the exact detail of what may occur during the next several years, on the basis that there is still too much latitude for further extraordinary policy intervention. However, we would make the observation that the reality is likely to be somewhere in between the two extremes of economic theory mentioned above. We do not subscribe to the view of a catastrophised future, but nor does it seem appropriate to believe that there will be a return to a more usual environment on the basis that policymakers are going to time everything perfectly in terms of their reversal of policy. Our view of the future, which is positive for the asset class, is of a world where the dollar struggles to retain its value, where inflation is higher than it is today and where many markets are driven by Chinese economic progress.


先说明一下,我是经济学的菜鸟。对于标红色的In a variation on the "heads-I-win-and-tails-you-lose" scenario这一句, 我觉得说的它意思说的是与heads-I-win-and-tails-you-loses(赢了算我的,输了算你的)的情况类似,意思就是不论怎样我都赢,因此许多人认为在凯恩斯主义占优或货币主义占优的境况下,商品市场似乎均可以获得较好的表现,因为variation有个意思是Something slightly different from another of the same type。但我的前辈说此处的意思是:与heads-I-win-and-tails-you-loses(赢了算我的,输了算你的)的情况不同商品市场在两种情况下似乎均可以表现良好。我觉得variation与different在程度上是有区别的,前者往往通常说的是量变(至少我觉得在这里是),而后者则一般都是有质的区别了。那么,请问各位高手,这句话到底是什么意思呢,是用“类似”妥当呢,还是“不同”更准确,或还是其他的意思或表达?。
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2009-6-16 05:57:43
variation 此处表示‘类似说法’。
你前辈是错误的。
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2009-6-16 07:37:37
应该是“不同”的意思 不知道那个象牙塔的结论是什么,但从后面哪一句可以看出。就是the conclusions from many seem to be that commodities would do well under either scenario可以看出,从很多人的结论中可以看出市场在其中人一种情况下都会运行良好,也就是说有两种情况,那前面只是一种情况“赢了算我的,输了算你的”第二种情况肯定不同于这种情况了。那么那个variation 肯定是“不同”的意思。
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2009-6-16 08:12:24
还是要听前辈的啊,前辈是对的
首先考虑"heads i win tails u lose" 的意思基本上就是heads我赢了(这和tails u lose完全是一个意思 哈哈)。在英文里,"heads i win tails u lose"大概是“不是输就是赢的意思”。但是commodity的情况就不同了--无论怎样它都是赢的.
hope that helps
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2009-6-16 12:21:51
在此先多谢各位的热心指教:
一.对于fffadeecec1学友的观点,我想作以下说明:

fffadeecec1学友说到:应该是“不同”的意思 不知道那个象牙塔的结论是什么,但从后面哪一句可以看出。就是the conclusions from many seem to be that commodities would do well under either scenario可以看出,从很多人的结论中可以看出市场在其中人一种情况下都会运行良好,也就是说有两种情况,那前面只是一种情况“赢了算我的,输了算你的”第二种情况肯定不同于这种情况了。那么那个variation 肯定是“不同”的意思。

而我认为:
1.
象牙塔的讨论应是没有结论,因为原文并未指出凯恩斯主义学派与货币主义学派的论战达成了一致意见(似乎也不可能达成一致)。若有妥协那可能是指现实情况刚好是两种主义的折中,见“However, we would make the observation that the reality is likely to be somewhere in between the two extremes of economic theory mentioned above. ”一句。

2.
个人觉得In a variation on the "heads-I-win-and-tails-you-lose" scenario1the conclusions from many seem to be that commodities would do well under either scenario2中的scenario一词并不是一回事,看一看上文“One school of thought is that, …”与“Another is that there is no viable alternative to the current Keynesian stimulus plans, …”指的是货币主义学派与凯恩斯主义学派的应对美国当前危机的不同观点和措施,请看这一句“But why might all of the ivory tower debate matter for commodity investors?”,明显说的是这两种学派的不同应对措施会对commodity investors有什么影响呢,再看下文“ In the inflationary world,…”与“In a New Deal (new version ) world,…”则分别与上文对应,是实施货币主义学派与凯恩斯主义学派各自措施后的结果(影响),因此可见(under eitherscenario2指的是“在采用了两种学派的不同应对措施后各自的情况下”,意即这两种学派的争论对commodity investors没什么影响(商品都会表现良好)(但作者并非完全同意此“没什么影响”的观点,看下文的“A pause is warranted here. A groundswell of opinion that says markets will go up come what may, should be cause for concern.”一句便知)。而回过来看一下
scenario
1它这里指的就是in the situation of “a variation on the "heads-I-win-and-tails-you-lose” ,而与scenario2指代的内容并不一样。 (若要把两个scenario做为一个看待的话,那就可以这样理解(似乎牵强),either scenario中的两种scenario即为scenario heads-I-win”或scenario tails-you-lose”,不过这样理解的话,“variation”还是在说“类似”)。—————— 我现在把第一段的前面一点贴出来,可能会有些帮助,the debate might be summarized with the following questions: "Given current ongoing plans for fiscal stimulus, how will debt service payments be managed in the future?" & "How could the current performance of the bond market be explained?" Answers to both are many and varied. 然后就是 One school of thought is that…”了。


二.对于jennyyuejin学友的观点,我想作以下说明:

jennyyuejin学友说到:首先考虑"heads i win tails u lose" 的意思基本上就是heads我赢了(这和tails u lose完全是一个意思 哈哈)。在英文里,"heads i win tails u lose"大概是“不是输就是赢的意思”。但是commodity的情况就不同了--无论怎样它都是赢的.

而我认为:heads i win tails u lose说的是好像不是“不是输就是赢的意思”,而是说对于我来而言怎么都会赢,因为我是不会lose的(tails u lose),这与另一句heads u win tails i lose刚好相反(对于我来说怎么都会输),不知此位学友意见如何?
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2009-6-16 21:33:06
这个帖子不会就这样沉了吧?
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