有实习经验回国还是要master才ok么？有manulife offer马上要决定！求助！ - 经管之家

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有实习经验回国还是要master才ok么？有manulife offer马上要决定！求助！

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收藏 2013-01-22

急问啊！我manager叫我lunch time之后开会讨论return的问题。不知道大家知不知道waterloo的coop，我这次是最后一个work term在manulife，要决定之后毕业full time的事情，但是我完全不想继续留加拿大，想回国过日子。因为coop，我们本科5年，所以也不太想去读研，总觉得自己太老了－－。。一把岁数。。但是听说回国一定要graduate，undergrad都不要啊。。有大牛来解答一下么？像我们这种实习经验好用么？！我在scotiabank，td security，manulife，london life都实习过。
老子就像回国吃个麻辣烫什么的咋这么难啊啊啊啊！！！

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2013-1-22 02:16:23

我也和你差不多情况啊，然后我打算Financial Engineering 的master了

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2013-1-22 02:21:32

看论坛里的其他帖子感觉国内的工作不那么好找我一同学国内本科毕业找到精算工作的真是踩了狗屎运碰上熟人介绍楼主慎重啊要回国也得找个好机会应该早点考虑啊这时候想有点晚吧

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2013-1-22 02:26:21

lamsadan 发表于 2013-1-22 02:16
我也和你差不多情况啊，然后我打算Financial Engineering 的master了

我不太想考gre。。要读FE的话，肯定还要去美国

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2013-1-22 02:28:16

鼻涕妞发表于 2013-1-22 02:21
看论坛里的其他帖子感觉国内的工作不那么好找我一同学国内本科毕业找到精算工作的真是踩了狗屎运碰上熟人 ...

我不想做精算，我在manulife和london life做过reinsurance，us gaap,pricing一些的东西。。感觉好无聊，应该回找pe，hedge fund那种工作

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2013-1-22 02:28:45

唉，先回公司开会去了。

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2013-1-23 05:27:58

小学弟，别急着喊老，full time之后你才知道什么是真的老的快。
你要想上个MFE渡渡金的话，去纽约NYU或者columbia都不太难进，最近几年在扩招，很多学精算的去，分数ok再好好准备申请录取问题不大。上学期间也有实习，最好是在纽约就进找工作。
waterloo自己那个MFE program也不错，不过要的录取分挺高的，UofT的那个也挺好的，但是听说比waterloo的贵不少，性价比不好（当然比去美国便宜多了）。
回国的话挺讲关系的，你在外面读得大学估计自己不会认识什么人了，家里关系不硬的话，只好恨爹不是刚啊。。另外现在海归的人很多，有几个coop term经验只是让你比别的应-届-生更有竞争力，得上几年班攒几年正式工作经验再就回国才会吃香。。。
另外你要是喜欢精算的话就留manulife，他们rotational program还不错，工作几年一遍攒经验一边把FSA拿了。你要是觉得精算工作无聊，就别勉强了，也就给你6-7万的样子，manulife里面精算学生又多又不好出头，你以后不打算继续做精算的话，不如趁着年轻好好去读个书

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2013-1-23 05:56:57

maomaochongz 发表于 2013-1-23 05:27
小学弟，别急着喊老，full time之后你才知道什么是真的老的快。
你要想上个MFE渡渡金的话，去纽约NYU或者c ...

My coop salary is about 6.5w per year. My manager told me I may get around 10w + bonus after I finish apc and get asa. But the thing is insurance is toooooooooooooooo boring...

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2013-1-23 06:00:54

maomaochongz 发表于 2013-1-23 05:27
小学弟，别急着喊老，full time之后你才知道什么是真的老的快。
你要想上个MFE渡渡金的话，去纽约NYU或者c ...

If I have to get master, I will definitely go to US. Don't wanna stay in CA anymore. My gpa is around 3.95 in 4.0 scale. I don't think it will be hard for me to get into top universities in us if gpa is the only requirement. But, GRE is damn hard...

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2013-1-23 06:30:49

kings_lucifer 发表于 2013-1-23 05:56
My coop salary is about 6.5w per year. My manager told me I may get around 10w + bonus after I fin ...

60k-ish pay sounds about right for loo coop students in their final term, but 100k pay for a new ASA sounds quite unrealistic in trt, considering how easy it is to get ASA these days, and loo students usually gets their prelims done by the time their graduate (i got all my prelims done during my 2nd yr coop term but i was intentionally rushing it for no real reason) , and ASA is just prelims + few modules (which are jokes btw, with their 80%+ pass ratios). But if your manager is white then he might expect ppl getting ASA 4-5 years after full time. I know some recent FSA w/ 1 year of exp getting only 80k at sunlife so....

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2013-1-23 06:47:12

kings_lucifer 发表于 2013-1-23 06:00
If I have to get master, I will definitely go to US. Don't wanna stay in CA anymore. My gpa is aro ...

tuitions in the states are very expensive but definitely worth the investment - since you probably would consider the time spent your biggest investment =D
also i heard B schools treat GPA and GRE only like a...meet-the-minimum-threshold thing, so you probably will still need to spend some time work on your package and reference etc.
btw out of curiosity.... what's 3.95 gpa in numerical grade? 90?

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2013-1-23 22:23:31

maomaochongz 发表于 2013-1-23 06:30
60k-ish pay sounds about right for loo coop students in their final term, but 100k pay for a new A ...

I think it may because I also have CFA and I am in a investment more likely department. Manulife startd to put more resources on investment and finance sectors since they lost so much 2 or 3 years ago. Another coop student got nearly 90k + bonus.(one good thing for chinese is we don't care about the so-called salary privacy) I think it is a pretty good pay. But it is not a fully investment group, it also has some insurance related projects. That's the part I don't like. I think the FSA you mentioned gets the pay too low. Up to know, based on what I have heared, there is no people get their offer less than 75k from the insurance companies.

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2013-1-23 22:34:04

maomaochongz 发表于 2013-1-23 06:47
tuitions in the states are very expensive but definitely worth the investment - since you probably ...

My average is 89.34 up tp now. I still have one more study term to go. My ActSc average is 90.8, but FARM one is a little bit lower(I forgot..- -) I think study is actually better than working, but the problem is I have to prepare for GRE and all the other stuff. I am a lazy person. I don't even understand why master is a prerequesition for finding a good job in china. In my current department in manulife, I don't even think we have master peopel.

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2013-1-23 22:48:53

kings_lucifer 发表于 2013-1-23 22:23
I think it may because I also have CFA and I am in a investment more likely department. Manulife s ...

oh so i guess you are in the math/bus double degree program. the CFA part explains the higher pay but i thought CFA charterholder requires like 4 years of finance related work experience...
also pure actsci ppl gets lower than what you mentioned, typically between 60K - 75K starting salary, but my info is 3 years old and my sample size is small (N~5) =D

and yeah FSA with <90k pay is pretty pathetic imho as well, but the person did the exams really fast and only had 1 year experience..and also was in the Kitchener office not trt one

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2013-1-23 22:57:35

maomaochongz 发表于 2013-1-23 22:48
oh so i guess you are in the math/bus double degree program. the CFA part explains the higher pay ...

I am not in double degree. I am in ActSc and FARM double major. CFA LEVEL 1 can be taken at fourth year. But it doesn't make sense to me, since the last work term pay has been around 65k, the graduation starting salary is only 60k - 75k even with coop experience. Btw, are you still in trt?~:)

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2013-1-23 23:01:55

kings_lucifer 发表于 2013-1-23 22:34
My average is 89.34 up tp now. I still have one more study term to go. My ActSc average is 90.8, b ...

i actually liked work better compare to school and i am also a lazy person haha

i don't think employers here expect any post-undergrad study for actsci roles since actsci ppl do the FSA/FCAS exams..but in china it's a different story, there are simply too many grad students so employers naturally set the bar higher...probably not a prerequisite but ppl do care about it, a lot

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2013-1-23 23:06:24

maomaochongz 发表于 2013-1-23 23:01
i actually liked work better compare to school and i am also a lazy person haha

i don't think e ...

In school, I don't have to wake up at 8am and go to work then. lol I don't usually attend lectures at loo, self-study is the best thing I have ever learnt in loo. Awwwww...I miss the food in China..why it's so hard to get back.~~ T T

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2013-1-23 23:10:15

kings_lucifer 发表于 2013-1-23 22:57
I am not in double degree. I am in ActSc and FARM double major. CFA LEVEL 1 can be taken at fourth ...

oh as a coop you are already doing full-time equivalent work so...
also coop is quite cheap to the companies. they get tax benefit from the government so essentially they only pay like 45k and the rest come from the government. also, overhead costs and full-time benefit are usually pretty good so they pay your health insurance, contribute to your retirement plan and provide you vacations etc. when you start full time but not as coop, so maybe that justifies that

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2013-1-23 23:17:23

kings_lucifer 发表于 2013-1-23 22:57
I am not in double degree. I am in ActSc and FARM double major. CFA LEVEL 1 can be taken at fourth ...

and yah unfortunately i am still stuck here...and probably need to stay here for another couple more years too, now my gf started working :( shall move to a warmer place in 5 years

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2013-1-23 23:25:36

maomaochongz 发表于 2013-1-23 23:10
oh as a coop you are already doing full-time equivalent work so...
also coop is quite cheap to th ...

I get it. But the salary is before tax..the damn high tax rate in ON is horrible. After tax, there will not be a large amont left. Are you in insurance company? Do you really enjoy it?

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2013-1-23 23:30:02

maomaochongz 发表于 2013-1-23 23:17
and yah unfortunately i am still stuck here...and probably need to stay here for another couple mo ...

So you have alreay immigrated CA? I am thinking maybe I will get PR before going back. But almost all my friends in CA tell me not to go back. They think China is a terrible place and they can't even breath there. It makes me feel bad.:/

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2013-1-23 23:51:41

kings_lucifer 发表于 2013-1-23 23:25
I get it. But the salary is before tax..the damn high tax rate in ON is horrible. After tax, there ...

I tried many different companies during my coops.tried reinsurance,insurance, consulting and government agency and both life and P&C.....and stayed in P&C cuz i found life work too boring (GGY axis...) if your position is investment related, i'd imagine it much much better than a typical life role. i am pricing P&C products and it is R&D related so i am happy with it. on the other hand, the cas exams are real pain in the ass...

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2013-1-24 00:01:32

kings_lucifer 发表于 2013-1-23 23:30
So you have alreay immigrated CA? I am thinking maybe I will get PR before going back. But almost ...

oh my parents immigrated when i was 13. i go back to china like every-other-year-ish, and just got back from my vacations in china earlier this month. beijing just had that mist thing in the past few weeks so it was pretty bad when i was there but i don't think it is always like that. china is heaven for young ppl with so many entertainment places to be after work, but if you like out door activities then canada is pretty good too (in the summer that is..unless ski is your thing)

the only thing that really bothers me in china is the traffic

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2013-1-24 00:03:21

maomaochongz 发表于 2013-1-23 23:51
I tried many different companies during my coops.tried reinsurance,insurance, consulting and gover ...

life is toooooo boring. It is like a circle receiving quote -> making assumption -> Eecel Development -> AXIS -> Meeting & Discussion... P&C I have never tried before, I returned london life once, attracted by the high salary - -. But the investment part in insurance is not good as that in banks such as RBC or BMO. I worked in TD Security before, that's fun but too tired...

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2013-1-24 00:10:52

赞lz 实习很多啊 CA insurance好找工作吗

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2013-1-24 00:16:23

maomaochongz 发表于 2013-1-24 00:01
oh my parents immigrated when i was 13. i go back to china like every-other-year-ish, and just got ...

I think CA is too boring for me. I started my grade 11 in CA, so it's pretty much like dropped from a city to a contry. Now I am regret for choosing coop, it too waste of time for me. I cannot see much benefit I can get if I want to get a job in China.
My boss just passed by to ask me about the decision..OMG...

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2013-1-24 00:21:27

jinziqi 发表于 2013-1-24 00:10
赞lz 实习很多啊 CA insurance好找工作吗

it's a coop program. Everyone has to find their job for work term. Before graduation, we will have at least 5 work terms. I don't know how is CA and insurance job market right now, since I haven't tried to look for a job. What I have got is a full time return offer from my current employer.

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2013-1-24 01:13:38

kings_lucifer 发表于 2013-1-24 00:03
life is toooooo boring. It is like a circle receiving quote -> making assumption -> Eecel Developm ...

P&C is not as mature field as life and there are always new products/ideas so potentially more exciting work, and the work makes me happy that i know i am making some difference not just maintaining things...
if you also consider working for a bank you will face that trade-off, it's definitely more interesting projects and arguably higher pays compare to the insurance field but a lot more time commitment for someone to shine. if you really decided that's your thing, i'd recommend you start doing that now in your early-mid 20s while you still have the energy and passion, once you have a family it will be much harder to make those commitments

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2013-1-24 01:34:17

kings_lucifer 发表于 2013-1-24 00:16
I think CA is too boring for me. I started my grade 11 in CA, so it's pretty much like dropped fro ...

yep ca is not as excited place to live, but it does put a ease in your mind (more so than the states... let alone china) and you will value that more as you age.. at least i felt that way

you'd have no idea how much the coop experince helps you in the long run it will open many doors for you. almost 3 years out of school, when i interviewed with other companies they still ask me questions about my coop terms and my foreign exchange study term, just because there're so much you can talk about them. you also make connections to your past coop places and you never know when you will run into familiar faces again (and on top of that coop pays you well too) so it's definitely not time wasted hehehe

also don't panic that your boss is pushing you now, think about that you want to achieve in 5-10 years and if the position offered to you moves you towards your goal. don't worry too much about the pay, you will get your 6-figures in 2-3 years regardless of your starting salary,even faster if you perform well, plus they don't make that much difference after tax anyway.. focus on the potential of the position, for example if you want to go back to china, how valuable the experience is after X years etc.

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2013-1-28 23:53:57

maomaochongz 发表于 2013-1-24 01:34
yep ca is not as excited place to live, but it does put a ease in your mind (more so than the stat ...

Sorry for replying you this late. I got cold. T T I wanna tell you that I rejected the offer from Manulife. I think the investment part in insurance is not well developed. No, it's more than not well developed, they actually have wrong scope about the finance and investment. Now I understand why Manulife suffered a big loss previously. (we had a group meeting, which made me disappoint at them). I think I may try other security or investment bank after graduation. If I can't find the ideal job, I will go for graduate.

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